The Cinemaphiles Discussion Forum

[Brando]

So I found your article pretty interesting Scotty Burger.

I saw Sphere years ago at Taylor's house on TBS or TNT or some network like that and remember being intrigued but not really gripped by it. Maybe I need to go to back to that one.

Dark City is one of my favorite movies of all time and think it definitely works on this list, but I'm surprised The Matrix isn't on the list either. They have similarities without a doubt and while Dark City is my heart pick over The Matrix, I think The Matrix had a major air of WTF?! Especially with it's marketing campaign of "What is the Matrix?"

I liked Stay quite a bit, but for some reason also can't remember much of it. This is odd for me cause I usually remember movies very well. While it wasn't good enought to obviously make a huge mark on me I do remember enjoying it and liking all the performances. I was definitely saying WTF the whole time and trying to figure out what was going on. I can't remember if there's any reasonable way of actually figuring it out before the "twist" but I don't feel like there was. I do remember really liking the editing, too, though.

Donnie Darko. Man I can't believe this is only #7. This could probably number 1 or 2 on my list, but admittedly I haven't really sat down to think about it. All I know is for the vast majority of the movie I was constantly asking WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON!?! WHY IS THERE A DEMONIC BUNNY TALKING ABOUT THE END OF THE WORLD? WHEN WILL THINGS MAKE SENSE? WHY IS THERE AN INVISIBLE WALL IN BETWEEN DONNIE AND THE BUNNY? A lot of it's WTF-ness comes from its vagueness and slightly Lynchian touches. Even more WTF is the official website. It makes you think there's more depth and meaning and unsolved mystery to little pieces of the movie that I really don't think are more deep or meaningful. GREAT pick, though.

Cube. Yes. A million times yes. I don't even want to talk about it cause I just want people to go watch it. Some decent acting...some AWFUL acting...but the WTF factor is sky high and unique. I love it.

12 Monkeys is a very good movie. To me, though, it's a much more straight forward...or...mainstream attempt at a WTF movie. I feel like sometimes with the indie or low budget films you get a product that is full scale WTF MATE??!?! Cause they don't have to worry about big name actors, studio input, etc. Not that this had a high amount of that, cause I really don't know if that's the case...but I do remember thinking it was kind of WTF-lite. Frustrating at times (not in a bad way, but in a...well you know the ending...sort of way). I really need to go back and watch this, though, cause I think it was my freshman year of college when I actually saw it last. It's possible that I'm being too harsh on it. Still, though, it's possible I'm not cause you have it at #5

Man oh man do I love Fight Club. This may very well be my #1 pick just because when I saw it (I was 16 or 17 yrs old and in high school) I truly had never seen ANYTHING like it before. Never had a movie seemed so surreal, engrossing, and so able to mess with my head. Incredibly crazy mindscrew yet once you watch it a few times and are able to keep up with all of the layers it is simply one of the best films ever made.

I really enjoyed Identity, but not in the way I've enjoyed most of these other movies you've listed. I know it's your favorite movie of all time so I won't bash it. In fact I don't really have much to bash it for, other than it just didn't catch me by surprise. You and I recently talked about the final final twist at the end, and while I admit I hadn't guessed it, it also didn't really take me by major surprise or blow me away. To me, Identity was a well made and well above average horror movie. I usually am not that into horror/slasher flicks, but that's the charm of Identity. It transcends the typical and becomes something a little better and a lot more refreshing.

Se7en. Definitely dude. If for nothing else but the end. It's one of those that sticks with you and poses questions that you think about long afterwards. Still, the rest of the movie ranks super high on the WTF-o-Meter as well...especially with each deadly sin/murder correlation.

I have to agree with you on Saw. It may not be my number were I to make a list, but when it came out there was nothing like it. It seems conventional and obvious now, since there have been 973 sequels and even more copycats, but when it first came out I remember thinking it was one of the most original movies I had ever seen. The beauty in it was not that it was scary, but the fact that the villain had a twisted moral code that you could almost understand and find reasonable. Almost. I love movies that make you think, and make you examine even the finest shades of gray, rather than viewing the world as an obvious black and white or an obvious good and evil.

I'll come back sometime with my own Top 10. Holla...well done Scott!

[Twitch_Comedy2124]

BJC,

Sphere...the main reason I put that in there, is, upon much though, that was the first movie I ever saw that had an unusual ending and opened me up to unusual endings. Other than that, I really don't remember much of it.

As far as Teh Matrix not making the list...I find there are far more movies that left me with a WTF taste in my mouth than the Matrix. This may sounds strange, but the Matrix flowed too well and too straight forward to be a WTF movie. I mean that by, it never went left, when I was sure it was going right. I don't think The Matrix was ever really trying to confuse you or lead you one way and then abruptly change. I think it became confusing more in its own philosophy than anything else (especially noticed in the sequels).

Stay...yeah...there are several clues that something is off, but from what I can tell, they are merely clues that let the viewer know......that something is off. The editing really makes this movie in my opinion. Especially given the ending. Brilliant.

Donnie Darko...as far as it being number 7...this whole list was darn near impossible to make an order of 1-10...all I can say is, if all the movies on this list were racecars and it was the last lap each one would be about 1/1000th of a second behind the other.

Cube. Enough said. We don't need to sit around and arouse ourselves by talking about this movie anymore than we already have.

12 Monkeys...I would watch it again if I were you...especially since I do believe you are being too harsh on it. It was directed by Terry Gilliam (which you probably already knew), which also means that studio interference was probably close to nil. Watch it again and lets discuss...or, let's watch it, then discuss it.

Ah...Good ol' Fight Club. Watched it over at Beers' house after watching South Park: Bigger Longer Uncut. My mind has forever been warped.

Identity-Love it.

Se7en-David Fincher = Champion Director. What really screwed with my mind about this one was...well...everything.

Saw. I recently read on rottentomatoes.com an article where this guy writes about Saw 2 and how he liked it better than Saw. Bunch o poppycock if you ask me...but hey, its his opinion. Saw had so much "charm" about it (if you can call it that) in that it was about the characters and their struggle to become free and try to figure it out. Not just, characters dying off one by one...and that's also where the, once again, charm comes to play. Only "2 characters" so the chances of them killing each other off are slim, MAKING the movie focus more on plot and character development, rather than, "how are we going to kill this person."

[Brando]

Sco'donell,

You made a racecar analogy. Well played.

I understand what you're saying about Sphere. My first experiences with movies that had endings that left my jaw on the floor were these three: Arlington Road, Reservoir Dogs, and Fight Club. Going back I still think AR and FC have astonishing endings, but RD has since lessened, but at the time I'd never seen anything quite like it.

I think for the Matrix it depends on when you saw it and if you had heard anything about it. Their whole marketing campaign was built around mystery: what is the Matrix? And whatisthematrix.com I saw it when it first came out. There was no hype, no following, no spoilers. Just a movie shrouded in mystery and when I saw it for the first time I had a WTF is going on experience. It may not have qualified as an F-ed up movie, cause I don't think it is, but at the time I'd never seen anything quite like it and the first movie had that nice air of mystery about it.

You're right. I do need to see 12 Monkeys again. I haven't seen it since my freshman year of college so...8 years ago?

I agree with your assessment of the first Saw movie. There was a moral ambiguity about it and the stakes were way higher since, like you mentioned, there were only 2 characters trapped in Jigsaw's game as the central piece for the movie.